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1patriot4life
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#1 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 04:38 |
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| Just curious as to what the most popular surge guards are being used by the members of this forum? I mean the one you use between the post and your trailer. Last edited on Wed Mar 10th, 2010 05:03 by 1patriot4life
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Burt Gifford
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#2 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 06:36 |
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This is what I use.
http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/50-amp-hard-wired-surge-guard/18541
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gyropilot
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#3 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 14:01 |
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Burt Gifford wrote: This is what I use.
http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/50-amp-hard-wired-surge-guard/18541
Ditto... except I use the 30 amp flavor for our 25R.
One nice feature this brand of surge guard has is under- and over-voltage protection. If the supplied voltage strays too far outside of a safe range it cuts power and will automatically reset when the voltage returns to a safe range.
We inadvertently tested this out a couple of years ago when staying at a remote desert campground near Death Valley NP. The surge guard repeatedly cut power to our travel trailer due to excessively high voltage present throughout the park. This particular RV park used a diesel generator for power and had the voltage turned up high to try and overcome a long wire run from the generator down to the park. The experience of having the power repeatedly kick off was annoying, but I was glad to have the sensitive electronics in our travel trailer protected.
John L.
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SWC7916
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#4 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 19:21 |
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| I'm thinking about the need for a surge protector also and would like to know why the two of you have the hard-wired ones rather than the portable ones.
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Adam
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#5 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 19:56 |
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| I installed the same hard wired brand as Burt and Gyropilot. I choose the hardwire one over the portable type for piece of mind, as in lot harder to steal when I am out and about.
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Robburns
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#6 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 20:01 |
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whats the difference between the ones you guys use and the $99 ones from the same mfg?
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gyropilot
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#7 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 20:37 |
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Adam wrote: I installed the same hard wired brand as Burt and Gyropilot. I choose the hardwire one over the portable type for piece of mind, as in lot harder to steal when I am out and about.
Exactly the same reason why I went with a hard wired version... can't be stolen when locked away inside the electrical compartment. If you have the version hanging out there on the power pedestal, it would seem to be yelling: "STEAL ME"
John L.
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gyropilot
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#8 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 20:50 |
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Robburns wrote: whats the difference between the ones you guys use and the $99 ones from the same mfg?
Model 44740 has fewer features and has a lower current limiting rating than the other models.
Also, from what I can tell it LACKS:
- Automatic reset when tripped.
- Low or high voltage disconnect.
- Status indicator lights showing a mis-wired pedestal, reverse polarity, or elevated ground voltage.
- 2-1/4 minute auto reset delay to allow AC compressor pressure to bleed off.
THIS COMPARISON CHART ON THE SURGE GUARD WEB SITE might be helpful.
John L.
Last edited on Wed Mar 10th, 2010 20:58 by gyropilot
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Grizzer10
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#9 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 21:10 |
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I got the portable 30 amp version for several reasons. I wanted to use the generator and the surge protector will not allow that without tricking it by tying together the neutral and ground wires. Also, this is probable not my last trailer and I wanted to take the surge protector with me. Last and perhaps most important was I could not figure out a good place to put it without a lot of rewiring.
I asked on several forums about them being stolen. Many people have the portable version and very few had problems with theft. There is also a lock that will keep honest people honest. Like most things if they really want it they will get it.
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1patriot4life
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#10 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 21:39 |
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So I'm leaning towards the hard wire set up for security reasons. Is it possible to wire it in with some sort of manual switch so you can bypass the surge gaurd while running off the gen.?
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Burt Gifford
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#11 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 21:51 |
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I'm sure that you could do that, 1Pat... but Why? Gen sets can produce spikes & dirty power too. A good surge guard works on a generator as well.
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gyropilot
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#12 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 21:59 |
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Grizzer10 wrote: I wanted to use the generator and the surge protector will not allow that without tricking it by tying together the neutral and ground wires.
Interesting.
What brand and model generator are you using?
Our Honda EU2000 works fine with a hard-wired 30A model Surge Guard unit.
John L.
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1patriot4life
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#13 Posted: Wed Mar 10th, 2010 22:01 |
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Burt Gifford wrote: I'm sure that you could do that, 1Pat... but Why? Gen sets can produce spikes & dirty power too. A good surge guard works on a generator as well.
I've heard of a few people having problems with their surge guard faulting, not allowing them to run off their generator. I'v got a Honda 2000i that produces nice clean power as far as I know and would hope I'd have no problem running it through a surge gaurd but just kind of like the option of bypassing it for some reason?
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Grizzer10
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#14 Posted: Thu Mar 11th, 2010 00:20 |
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Many people have posted that their Honda 2000 generators will not work with a Surge Guard.
I tested my Honda 2000i with my new 30 amp portable Surge Guard and it would not allow the generator to provide power to the trailer 120V system. Maybe the portable model is different from the wired in? That is really not a problem since the Honda puts out clean power and does not need surge guard protection. Apparently some surge protectors allow you to force the protector to accept the generator, but I don't think mine has that feature.
As I understand it, one of the tests the Surge Guard requires is that the neutral and ground are bonded together and the Honda generator fails that test. A simple way to fix this is to get a plug and wire the ground to the neutral on the output side of the plug and plug it in to the generator and that will bond the neutral to the ground. I am not an electrician and was uncomfortable modifying what the Honda engineers had designed and so chose to just use the generator directly when necessary.
I suspect there must be a switch that would allow one to change from the surge protector and an unprotected system. I usually find that if I can imagine a piece of hardware it is available somewhere.
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Frederick
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#15 Posted: Thu Mar 11th, 2010 01:42 |
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| I'm using the 50 amp portable surge gard from camping world. I also purchased the optional locking cap that fits around it. During a 9000 mile journey last Fall it saved me three (3) times in campgrounds where adjacent motorhomes without surge protectors experienced costly repairs. There was once or twice when the plug-in post receptacle was a bit short in height. With that said, I'm very pleased with it.
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rchessen
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#16 Posted: Thu Mar 11th, 2010 12:35 |
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While there are many kinds and prices I would suggest you consider one that not only protect from power surges, but also low and high voltage. Not all surge protectors are equal. Does it make sense to get a cheap protector to protect a multi thousand dollar investment. Surges are not the only danger. You should consider Hi/Low voltage, line fault etc. also. The electronics in things like AC, Refer, heater etc don't do well on low voltage. To get a good protector be prepared to spend $300 plus dollars. Example is one like the Progressive Industries EMS 30 or 50 volt. Its not difficult to hard wire them into the trailer. Plus "if" you spend this kind of money you don't want it to walk away.
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Crowsnest Pass
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#17 Posted: Thu Mar 11th, 2010 14:13 |
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I just purchase a surge protector Surge Guard®
30A Hardwire and was set to install it in my 30U. Then I read this post. We do most of our camping in the back country and use a genny ( mitsubishi 5800 W) do you think that we will have a problem? I sent an e-mail to the manu. but have not recieved a reply yet. Your replys will be greatly appreciated.
Charles
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gyropilot
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#18 Posted: Thu Mar 11th, 2010 14:53 |
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Grizzer10 wrote: I tested my Honda 2000i with my new 30 amp portable Surge Guard and it would not allow the generator to provide power to the trailer 120V system. Maybe the portable model is different from the wired in?
There must be something different between our two setups then, because as I said, our hard wired 30A model works perfectly with either of our two Honda EU2000's (one's a regular and one's a companion model). We used one extensively when dry camping in Great Basin National Park about a year and a half ago, and I never gave it a second thought. I can't imagine why there would be any difference in the construction between the two versions of the Surge Guards, other than one has the plugs and sockets, and the other has the screw terminals. Maybe we have a difference in our trailer's wiring?
The only out-of-the-ordinary behavior I've ever noticed with the Surge Guard was when I've inadvertently pulled too many amps (as in trying to run too many appliances at once) with the generator in Eco-mode (low-speed setting), and as a result the input voltage to the trailer dropped just above the point where the Surge Guard seemed to be trying to disconnect the power. In this case the Surge Guard would "clatter" or "buzz" loudly before the EU2000 could ramp up the rpms... like the contactors inside were rapidly cycling. It was a scary sound and I didn't let it happen again!
But I've never had any grounding errors or done anything different with either my trailer's wiring or the EU2000's wiring.
BTW, anyone needing help with Honda EU2000 generator issues can find lots of knowledge on Yahoo's Honda EU2000 Generator Group.
Best regards,
John L.
Last edited on Thu Mar 11th, 2010 15:04 by gyropilot
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Falconman
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#19 Posted: Thu Mar 11th, 2010 15:01 |
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I have the Progressive Industries EMS 50A. It's hardwired. The only reason for me not to hardwire it would be if I intended to sell the rig and I wanted to keep it. Since I don't, it's not an issue. I'm sure I could unwire it if needed. I also like the remote digital display. A portable unit would be another thing to deal with at setup/ takedown.
Last edited on Thu Mar 11th, 2010 15:01 by Falconman
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MaxItOut
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#20 Posted: Thu Mar 11th, 2010 16:19 |
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Here's what worked for me:
My Nash 22H originally came with ~ a 25 foot shore line. I cut it so there was only a 3 foot length remaining in the small cable compartment. Then...- Attached a 30 amp RV male fixture to the end of that 3 foot length.
- Attached a 30 amp female fixture to the remaining 22 foot cable making it a regular free-standing 22 foot 30 amp male/female cable.
- Bought a regular 50 foot 30 amp male/female cable.
- Connect the male end of the 22 foot or 50 foot cable to the pedestal.
- Connect the female end of that cable to a Progressive Industries portable EMS-PT30C electrical protection unit.
- Connect the 3 foot male end of the trailer cable to the EMS-PT30C.
Result:- The portable EMS-PT30C electrical protection unit is hidden from view inside the cable compartment. The visible connection at a park pedestal appears to be just be a direct-connect.
- One may connect either the 22 or 50 foot cable to the pedestal and then connect the EMS-PT30C to that cable. Any error results may be viewed on the portable EMS-PT30C hidden from view inside the cable compartment. This may be done before there is any connection to the trailer. If no electrical errors are displayed then the connection is completed by plugging the 22H 3 foot cable male end to the female EMS-PT30C receptacle.
- I believe the 10 gauge cable utilized (for the 3, 22 and 50 foot lengths) can safely handle 30 amps for a total of about 70 feet or so based on available voltage drop calculators. Therefore, if needed I could connect both the 22 and 50 foot cables in series if the 30 amp service is excessively distant from the 22H location. (note: I have not done this, and as I am not an electrician this possibility is just offered FWIW).
This way allows use of a portable surge/voltage/error protection unit, the unit remains concealed, and it also lets one use a more flexible cable length than what is originally supplied.
Please feel free to controvert any aspect of what I presented if your better experience indicates it. I am just a novice and I look to this forum as a most knowledgeable resource.
Best wishes,
Dan
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