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Jasmar T
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#1 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 04:55 |
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Now I am going to ask the one question that generates lots of debates; if I purchase a Diesel, which brand?
But given your experiences, why should I purchase a Ford, GMC, or Dodge: what are the pro and cons based on your experience in recent years?
JASMAR
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Robburns
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#2 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 13:14 |
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just my $.02. All the new ones suck on MPG because of the emissions stuff.
I am preferential to Dodge due to the Cummins motor, but I know that Ford and Chevy have a more comfortable interior. I have had mine since 9/08 and have been very happy with it (especially once i removed the emissions stuff for better mileage.) The factory exhaust brake is also really nice. Going down a 6% grade with my 22h, i had to turn off tow/haul mode because it was working too well 
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63hawk
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#3 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 14:11 |
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| The Big Three each have their quirks and strong points so buy the brand you feel the most loyalty toward. I spent many months "lurking" on various diesel forums before making my decision. My budget dictated something used-lower initial price and better fuel economy-so I had to do lots of homework. I also had to consider that I wanted my DW to be able to feel comfortable driving it. I expected to have to fix a few things and chose the truck that seemed to require the fewest extremely labor intensive (i.e. costly) repairs. Opinions abound but there are many diesel forums with lots of good info so spend some time on them. So far I have been very satisfied with my decision, DW actually LIKES to drive the crew cab long bed but doesn't like to park it and so far I have gotten 13.5 mpg while towing, about what I had expected. Also, expect the prices on 2011 models to take a big jump due to increased emissions paraphernalia and inflation........
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Onug
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#4 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 14:53 |
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Do you want new or used?
On the new side:
Dodge - Has a new look this year, matching what they released in their half-ton last year. Their Cummin's engine is already 2010 emissions compliant, so it is basically the same engine with a 6-speed tranny that they released back in '07. I saw one on a dealer lot last weekend, so they're in circulation.
GM - The Chevy/GMC trucks are getting a new frame this model year, as well as a revised engine to handle the 2010 emissions. They come with the awesome Alison 6-speed tranny. The trucks haven't hit the dealer lots yet and probably won't for a few months. Pricing isn't available yet.
Ford - The SDs have a new look, engine and tranny this year (model year 2011). The engine is all new, designed and built by Ford. Same with the 6-speed tranny. The truck has a new design, but under the skin most of the major components are the same. The 2010 units on the lots right now are not 2010 compliant, but were built before the end of the year and have the older engine and 5-speed tranny. As with GM, the 2011 trucks haven't hit the lot yet and probably won't for a few months.
If you want a new Ford or GM, research DEF (diesel emissions fluid). It is a new fluid that is injected into the exhaust and has to be refilled occasionally. Dodge doesn't use DEF, they have a special ($$) filter on the exhaust.
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Stu
2009 Arctic Fox 26Z2
2007 GMC "Classic" Sierra 2500HD
2010 Stats: Miles - 270, Nights - 2
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kerry4951
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#5 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 15:04 |
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I also pondered for several months before making my decision. When I had my business I always had Ford "gas" engines, and could not of been happier with the service they provided me. When I decided to go to diesel (in 2007), I went for the Chevy Duramax. One of the things that sold me was their mate with the Allison tranny. I had the allison in my old motorhome and they are unbeatable. I dont want to start any "truck fights", because they all have their own pluses and minuses. I found the best approach was to talk to several owners of each brand. I just heard too much negative around the Ford diesels at that time. Even from Ford personnel at my local garage, they suggested going with one of the gas engines. And since Ford was just coming out with the newer diesel version ( in 2007), I did not want to be the guinea pig. Since I had my mind made up to go to a diesel, I bought a Chevy 2500. One of my other deciding factors was the "noise level". I really didnt want a loud diesel (although some like that harder sound), and the Duramax is relatively quiet compared to the other brands. In all fairness I really didnt look much at the Dodges, so I cant say a whole lot about those. I think I shyed away from them only due to the "noise" issue, plus they did not have the allison combo. I have since traded up to a Chevy 3500 dually and absolutely love it. The interior in the Chevy is very comfortable, and I have even pleased the wife as she can be very critical of uncomfortable seats. I decided to move on my 2009 only because I didnt want to face any more emissions stuff (urea canister) and the increase in cost to get the diesel package (they say around $10K), in the 2011's. NOTE: The Dodges will not have the urea canister as they (Cummins) have already met the stricter emissions standards. Ford and GMC/Chevy will.
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another ken
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#6 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 15:40 |
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Tom, you are partial to gm so stay with it.
As stated above they all have problems and
good points.
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yorkies77
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#7 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 16:17 |
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I bought a Dodge because the Cummins is a medium duty engine and also the reputation of Cummins. What I would really like to see is any of the three with a Cummins with an Alison behind it. I believe that would be an ideal combination. What are the odds? That said I have not had any problems at all with my 01 Dodge. Plenty of power and I get between 11 and 12 mpg pulling our 34' fiver. Loaded our unit weighs 14,500. Good luck with your decison.
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DesertFox1
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#8 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 16:33 |
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another ken wrote: Tom, you are partial to gm so stay with it.
That's partly why I stuck with GM. All my rigs have been GM.
Also, I like the step in height of the GMs better... they aren't as tall as a comparable Ford or Dodge.
I have two GM dealers nearby to choose from for warranty work, They both have treated me well, though I do prefer one service dept over the other.
Another reason I went GM - the dealer I bought form offers free lifetime LOFs, even on a D/A. I'm fully capable of doing my own LOFs, but I have 4 vehicles in my fleet, and it's hard finding the time or motivation to do it all considering the other stuff that keeps me busy.
Last edited on Wed Jan 27th, 2010 16:35 by DesertFox1
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kimshew
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#9 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 17:26 |
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| Jasmar: If you are thinking a diesel go to a truck dealer NOT a car dealer. The selection is better and the sales people know more. I only know about Ford and there is a truck dealer in Sacramento, West Sacramento, Corning, and Santa Cruz .
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foxyrvlady
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#10 Posted: Wed Jan 27th, 2010 18:22 |
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Also don't deal with the salesmen at the truck dealer--go to the fleet dealer unless you are going to a dealer you have a relationship with and know someone!
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Linda & Dave (retired US Army) & Jake the Lab
2002 Arctic Fox 25R, Honda 2000i, Trojan T-125's
2003 DODGE 3500 SLT Quad Cab, 4x4, SRW, HO CTD, 3.73, 48RE, Jake Brake
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DesertFox1
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#11 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 00:03 |
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foxyrvlady wrote: Also don't deal with the salesmen at the truck dealer--go to the fleet dealer unless you are going to a dealer you have a relationship with and know someone!
yes, exactly.
That's the ONLY way to get an "easy, pain free" purchase experience. Deal with the "fleet sale people" at your dealer.... or find a truck through their online invenotry, then email them... my experience is that it's usually the fleet dept that handles their "internet sales" inquiries.
DO NOT go to the lot then get heckled by the general sales people.... establish a contact direct with the fleet dept first, whether it be via phone or email, THEN go to the lot.
I've bought my last two trucks like this, the last one being the phat one in my avatar.
As far as GM trucks go, short bed has a 26 gallon tank, long bed is either 32 or 34 gallon tank.
Last edited on Thu Jan 28th, 2010 00:06 by DesertFox1
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09 Chevy Dooley D/A LTZ
10 AF811
05 Aveo (DD)
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FF1063
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#12 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 00:45 |
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| If I had to buy one today, I would opt for the new Dodge. Main reason is the Cummins has already been meeting the new emissions without DEF. Initial issues have been resolved. There are many economic reasons not to buy a Dodge, but the same can be said for GM. Pricing / incentives are about equal for the 'build' a truck that I've researched. As a previous 'loyal' GM owner, sad to say I just don't like the look of the GM's, the IFS axle, and the small tire packages they offer. I wish I did, I'm trying...
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Shepherd
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#13 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 01:44 |
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Tom,
Everyone will have their own opinion based on many factors. My suggestion, go drive them all. As several have said, each have their pros and cons. I've rode in and driven all three; to me, Ford has the best comfort mixed with stoutness. GMC is nice to ride in, but I'm not partial to the suspension; too weak. As for Dodge, strong workhorse, but the seats are like riding on bricks. For me, I'm waiting for the 2011 Ford with the new motor/tranny set up. I've done quite a lot of research on it and spoken to several of the fleet folks & engineers; all indications are positive. Also, the Ford/Dodge dealer is right down the road so service/parts are easier to get.
Just my thoughts...
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Stu
2008 Nash 26Z2
2003 F-250 V-10 Banks Powered SuperDuty Crewcab
2008 Sea Ray 185 Sport
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foxyrvlady
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#14 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 02:52 |
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Stu made some good points. If we were looking for a new truck, which we aren't, we'd be doing a lot of research. Chev has many good points. Many are hoping Ford will do it right the first time with their new engine--it sounds good. Dodge supposedly has improved their interiors a lot. We personally find our Dodge comfortable but know it ranks about 3rd in that category! Now if Toyota would just throw a HD oilburner into the mix....as long as the throttle pedal worked!
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Linda & Dave (retired US Army) & Jake the Lab
2002 Arctic Fox 25R, Honda 2000i, Trojan T-125's
2003 DODGE 3500 SLT Quad Cab, 4x4, SRW, HO CTD, 3.73, 48RE, Jake Brake
2010 Prius IV--love the 50 mpg!
AVATAR: Deer Camp, 2008, Wallowa Lake SP
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Rallen
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#15 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 03:48 |
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| I own a Dodge Gas, wish I had an older Dodge Diesel. We drive Fords at work, to the tune of 30k to 40k a year, F350's and F450's 4x4, you could only give me a new Ford diesel, long enough for me to trade it for a GM or Dodge. I have never been partial to anything except Toyota, but they got out of my price range. The new Ford diesels, have an aluminium plate that bolts to the front of the engine, that plate has water channels and an impeller for the water pump with a pulley on the outside for the belt. If you don't use the exact type of antifreeze and change it out as per maintenance schedule it will void the warranty. We have been through it on two trucks, when the plate was removed you could see where the nonwarranty antifreeze ate away or corroded the aluminium water pump/ impellar/ plate. Less than 50k on miles on both. Also, for some engine component work, the cab has to be removed, which sounds worse than it is, but it seems silly, and after it is resinstalled, squeeks and rattles abound.
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Jasmar T
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#16 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 04:13 |
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Just want to take this moment to thanks those that have responded. I am enjoy all the great information.
JASMAR (Tom)
PS Now that I am retired, I have lots of time to start driving all of them
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2010 GMC Sierra 2500HD SLT Crew Cab, Std Bed Duramax/Allison, Z-71 4x4
2007 Nash 22H
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Chipster
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#17 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 04:19 |
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This is a great discussion..I'm following with interest!! There were rumours of a Toyota 1 ton dually with an 8 liter Hino diesel, but they were only rumours...I think there is a diesel in our future, I just don't know which one. I like the looks of the Chevy 07 classic but low mileage ones are getting hard to find...
Randy
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Shane
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#18 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 22:35 |
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| Only two cents to add to this useful discussion. Given their durability and what you'll pay, the diesel will last a long time. If there's a possibility that a larger Northwood is in your future — especially a 5er, look ahead when selecting the truck features that you may want. For us, the DRW is important in pulling the 5er. Also, if you are looking at a GM/Chevy, watch for the 2011 models, for they may have a new engine and an Allison with new features,
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Babe the Brittany
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foxyrvlady
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#19 Posted: Thu Jan 28th, 2010 22:43 |
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For what it's worth (probably not much), or IMHO, this is a good time to sit back and watch what is going to shake out of the tow vehicle market. If a person needed to upgrade their truck NOW because of a vehicle failure, purchasing a larger RV, etc., then some good deals are out there. Dodge will pretty much stay the same as the new model, but changes are pretty immediate for the Ford (engine) and upcoming for the Chev. Fun to look, gather info and talk to owners, but I'd wait and see at this point if we were getting the new truck itch. 
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Linda & Dave (retired US Army) & Jake the Lab
2002 Arctic Fox 25R, Honda 2000i, Trojan T-125's
2003 DODGE 3500 SLT Quad Cab, 4x4, SRW, HO CTD, 3.73, 48RE, Jake Brake
2010 Prius IV--love the 50 mpg!
AVATAR: Deer Camp, 2008, Wallowa Lake SP
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DBCooper
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#20 Posted: Fri Jan 29th, 2010 16:17 |
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They all make good trucks. I used to be partial to GM, but own a Dodge because when I started buying diesels the Duramax wasn't out, I bought a Dodge and got to really enjoy not only the truck, but the Cummins. I'm on my second one now. I sold the last one with 210,000 (or abouts) miles and it was still a very nice truck.
I agree with Shepard on the trucks. This years Ford will have a engine that is VASTLY different from any other diesel engine offered in a pickup. It will have reverse flow heads, piezo injectors (used in the past)...all sorts of new stuff. Personally I wish them well with this one, but I would stay clear of it until it is proven.
The new Dodge uses last years mechanicals for the most part, with all new sheet metal and interior. It looks really, really nice. Hopefully they fixed the seats. They are not the most comfortable, and the interior, while looking nice is made of cheap materials and shows it.
I haven't heard anything about the new GM, but do know that they have to come up with something that meets 2010 emissions.
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2006 AF 31W Bunk, Air Safe Hitch, Xantrex RS2000 w/4 AGMs.
2004.5 Dodge 3500 Cummins 4 door dually six speed stick. PAC brake, air bags, Smarty, 4 wheel drive.
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